Quick-turn Red Ale

[bwarbiany]

Hey guys... The beer I'm brewing on 2/19 needs to be kegged and ready to drink on 3/5 -- only 14 day turn around. I had considered doing my RyePA, but that requires dry-hopping and I don't think I can turn it. Instead, I'm thinking of an American Red Ale. I haven't done too many of these, so take a look at the below recipe and let me know what you think. Can I turn this around in 9-10 days ferment and 3-day carbonating?

Note that the "Toasted Malt" will be 2-row that I toast in my oven, so the particular flavor profile is somewhat variable. I plan to use the Palmer method and toast dry @ 350 degrees for 1 hr.

My target (let me know if this is what I'll end up with):
I tend to want something that has a heavier copper appearance than a typical amber, but I often shy away from super-heavy crystal. Thus, I put a moderate but not overwhelming Crystal 80L dose with a bit of 20L to fill it out, and black patent to boost the color. I want the toasted malt to contribute actual flavor, and this character should balance the Crystal 80L a bit too. This is for a housewarming party, so I don't want to smash the IBU out of the park, but want a distinct hop aroma -- thus the 5oz of Cascade at flameout.

Code: Select all

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 15.00 gal      
Boil Size: 17.17 gal
Estimated OG: 1.056 SG
Estimated Color: 15.5 SRM
Estimated IBU: 28.5 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount        Item                                      Type         % or IBU      
24.00 lb      Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM)            Grain        76.80 %       
3.00 lb       Toasted Malt (27.0 SRM)                   Grain        9.60 %        
2.00 lb       Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM)     Grain        6.40 %        
2.00 lb       Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM)     Grain        6.40 %        
0.25 lb       Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM)           Grain        0.80 %        
1.75 oz       Magnum [14.00 %]  (60 min)                Hops         28.5 IBU      
5.00 oz       Cascade [5.50 %]  (0 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops          -            
2.00 items    Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min)          Misc                       
4 Pkgs        SafAle American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-05)    Yeast-Ale                  


Mash Schedule: My Mash
Total Grain Weight: 31.25 lb
----------------------------
My Mash
Step Time     Name               Description                         Step Temp     
60 min        Step               Add 36.29 qt of water at 163.4 F    151.0 F       

[BrewMasterBrad]

14 days should be no problem. I do have a couple suggestions and they are based solely on my opionion and you can take them or leave them. I would lower the OG a little so that you make sure this thing can ferment fully in the short time you have. There is no shame in producing a lower alcohol, full flavored beer. Also, at only 28 IBUs (plus whatever IBUs are added by your whirlpool hops), nearly 13% of crystal malts may leave this beer a little sweet and not as quaffable as a drier beer. Rather than boosting the IBUs to balance it out, you might try subbing in some Munich or Vienna to add some character while lowering the residual sweetness of the beer.

How long are you planning on having the Cascades in the hot wort before you start chilling? I am planning an Extra Pale Ale soon and I was going to add some Cascades at flame out and just leave them in the whirlpool for about 30 minutes before I start chilling.

[jward]

4oz of black patent malt will be a dominant flavor especially without some age. You might consider one of the de-husked/de-bittered dark malts. I have started testing with Carafa III. At Alcatraz Brewing the brewer there used darker crystal malts to get the color and skipped black malts altogether.

[bwarbiany]

Good points, Brad. I can definitely see myself replacing the 2# of Crystal 20L with Munich. That should help a bit. I'll probably leave the OG where it is, but I've been dealing with a bit of inconsistency (75% is my max, but I've been a bit low) in my efficiency, plus bumping this to a 15 gallon batch, I might naturally lose a little OG. I don't mind the recipe where it's at, so if I do hit my target, it should be okay, and if I end up low, I wont be crushed.

My chilling process is to recirculate wort through the CFC back into the boil kettle, running hose water through the CFC, immediately after turning off flame and continuing until I reach ~120 deg F in the kettle [maybe 20-30 min?]. I then run it through into the fermenter while circulating ice water through the CFC to get it to pitching temp. So the hops will be tossed in at boil, but the wort should be cooling relatively quickly.

[brahn]

4oz of black patent malt will be a dominant flavor especially without some age. You might consider one of the de-husked/de-bittered dark malts. I have started testing with Carafa III. At Alcatraz Brewing the brewer there used darker crystal malts to get the color and skipped black malts altogether.

I've never used black patent before, but I've used roast barley at around 1% of the grist with no noticeable flavor contribution. Brad's a bit below that with 4oz in a 15G recipe. Is black patent that much more noticeable than roast barley?

[bwarbiany]

4oz of black patent malt will be a dominant flavor especially without some age. You might consider one of the de-husked/de-bittered dark malts. I have started testing with Carafa III. At Alcatraz Brewing the brewer there used darker crystal malts to get the color and skipped black malts altogether.

I've never used black patent before, but I've used roast barley at around 1% of the grist with no noticeable flavor contribution. Brad's a bit below that with 4oz in a 15G recipe. Is black patent that much more noticeable than roast barley?

Either way, the main goal is color, not flavor, so I'm replacing it with either Carafa II or III, depending on what O'Shea has available. I've used the debittered malts before successfully, and preferably want this to interfere as little as possible with the Crystal, toast, or hop flavors.

[BrewMasterBrad]

4oz of black patent malt will be a dominant flavor especially without some age. You might consider one of the de-husked/de-bittered dark malts. I have started testing with Carafa III. At Alcatraz Brewing the brewer there used darker crystal malts to get the color and skipped black malts altogether.

I've never used black patent before, but I've used roast barley at around 1% of the grist with no noticeable flavor contribution. Brad's a bit below that with 4oz in a 15G recipe. Is black patent that much more noticeable than roast barley?

I regularly use black patent at .5% to .8% of the grist to add some color to Pale Ales and Amber Ales. I have never noticed a significant flavor contribution at those rates. Everyone has different flavor thresholds, however, and some people may just perceive the flavor based on the color of the beer. Besides adding some color to the beers, BP also helps to lower the mash pH (which may or may not be of significant value based on your source water).

[bwarbiany]

Besides adding some color to the beers, BP also helps to lower the mash pH (which may or may not be of significant value based on your source water).

Once I actually found my container of it, I've taken to regularly using 5.2 mash stabilizer. Seems like one of those "cheap insurance" measures that only has upside...

[jward]

Everyone has different flavor thresholds, however, and some people may just perceive the flavor based on the color of the beer.

This is what I tweak most in my red ale. Backing off the heavy roast does reduce the roast flavor for me but has been at the cost making the ale more copper then red. I have played with cold steeping and adding some dark roast malt at sparge. My next batch will be the full 4 oz in the mash and see how it does with time. I think I really enjoy that roast character after it has had 1-2 months to mellow. We'll see.

[BrewMasterBrad]

Everyone has different flavor thresholds, however, and some people may just perceive the flavor based on the color of the beer.

This is what I tweak most in my red ale. Backing off the heavy roast does reduce the roast flavor for me but has been at the cost making the ale more copper then red. I have played with cold steeping and adding some dark roast malt at sparge. My next batch will be the full 4 oz in the mash and see how it does with time. I think I really enjoy that roast character after it has had 1-2 months to mellow. We'll see.

That's what I love about this hobby - the endless variables and the taste testing.

[bwarbiany]

So, I've had this kegged a few days now, and it's *just* starting to come to full carbonation. I pulled a few pints last night and it is tasting pretty nice.

I would say, though, that I think it went slightly more aggressively hopped than intended [surprise surprise coming from me, I know]. I believe this hits the style of "San Diego Red Ale", not American Red Ale

[That said, I think nico soze is going to be VERY happy with his 5 gallons... No shortage of flavor in this beer!]

[nico soze]

I brought a 22 of this to show off a little early last night and it's definitely still green. Only 8 days bottle conditioning. Couple guys said I under aerated. We gotta meet up in a couple weeks and have them side by side. Maybe at out of the park.

[nico soze]

I also got a Newcastle clone in secondary that I should bottle the 20th

[JonW]

I brought a 22 of this to show off a little early last night and it's definitely still green. Only 8 days bottle conditioning. Couple guys said I under aerated. We gotta meet up in a couple weeks and have them side by side. Maybe at out of the park.

Seriously? They said you under aerated? And they said that based on how it tasted? Find some new critics.

Aeration is one small part of the whole process, but I can guarantee that your drive from Laguna to home sloshed it around enough to be sufficiently aerated. That and the fact that you pitched two packets of yeast in 5G (way more than enough) and you hit your FG just fine. There was no lack of aeration.

[brahn]

I brought a 22 of this to show off a little early last night and it's definitely still green. Only 8 days bottle conditioning. Couple guys said I under aerated. We gotta meet up in a couple weeks and have them side by side. Maybe at out of the park.

Seriously? They said you under aerated? And they said that based on how it tasted? Find some new critics.

Aeration is one small part of the whole process, but I can guarantee that your drive from Laguna to home sloshed it around enough to be sufficiently aerated. That and the fact that you pitched two packets of yeast in 5G (way more than enough) and you hit your FG just fine. There was no lack of aeration.

+1