Noob Equipment Questions

[robert_heat]

Ok so I just started up and am giong to follow some advice I saw to other noobies to brew a few batches before getting too carried away on equipment. Let me post what I have and maybe you guys can comment on a good progession?

I got the Deluxe Kit from O'shea's which includes:

Fermenting Bucket
Bottling Bucket
Glass Carboy
Hydrometer
Floating Thermometer (do I need a "pan" thermometer?)
Brew Pot
Bottle brush, Various tubing, Bottles, Capper, Caps, Grain Steeping Bag etc.

Basically it seems like I have everything I would need to brew and bottle small batches of beer.

Some comments from basic observations:

The buckets seem particularly flimsy, the lid doesn't seal very tightly and has a bit of play when you shake it which makes me worry about being air tight. The brew pot while not particularly high quality seems like it will do for a while.

After I brew a few batches what do you think my next step up in equipment should be? I have already established that I need a wine thief and will be picking one up shortly.

Would this next logical thing to be moving to a conical fermenter?

[robert_heat]

Oh yeah, wort chiller yes or no?

The whole sink thing back and forth was kind of a pain and seems like it wastes a ton of water. Are there other strategies for cooling the wort quickly?

[lars]

Hi Robert,
How big is your brewpot? If it is not big enough for full volume boils, that'd be your second upgrade. Your first upgrade should be a wort chiller, it is vital for you to cool your wort as quickly as possible and pitch yeast at the appropriate temps. Regarding the buckets, brewers get hung up on having a "good seal" on their fermenters. All you really need is a complex enough path such that the pathogens that are harmful to your beer are unable to get in. But, it is nice to have a decent seal so you can watch your airlock bubbling.

A conical is certainly not a vital piece of brew equipment. I had one a while back, and sold it to another member because I didn't use it. Now I use a 15 gallon plastic water container to ferment my 10 gallon batches. I also have two 6.5 gallon glass carboys in case I want to split a batch. Personally, I'd say get a few batches under your belt to see if the hobby is something you will continue to enjoy. If it is, then start upgrading. Beyond your basic equipment the next upgrade you will want is a kegging system. It is much easier to clean one large bottle, rather than 60 small ones.

[BrewMasterBrad]

At this point, a conical would be a waste of money. Carboys and buckets work just fine. A wort chiller is a must. I have a couple just like this that I have sitting around that I would be willing to part with for far less than a new one will cost you. I have scavenged the tubing for other uses, but that is easily replaceable.

Let me tell you the things that made the biggest difference in my beer quality. Making yeast starters and proper control of fermentation temperature. There are alot of variables when brewing, but the two most important things are pitching enough healthy yeast and controlling your fermentation temperature. Eventually, you may want to make the jump to all-grain, but I wouldn't even worry about it until you get those two things nailed down.

[bwarbiany]

Would this next logical thing to be moving to a conical fermenter?

Sure... While you're at it, can you pick one up for me? 20 gallons or larger, please.

Right now, the question for you is how big your boil kettle is. If you're not boiling the full amount (roughly 6-7 gallons to result in 5 at the end), that's one of the first things I'd change. Unfortunately, with that you probably need a wort chiller.

So the best next purchases (if you buy one, you'd better buy the other) are:

1) Turkey fryer from Home Depot ($50). Benefits are boiling the full quantity of wort, and moving the process outdoors (less worry of a boilover). If someday you quit brewing, you'll then be able to deep-fry some turkeys with it, so it won't go to waste.

2) Wort Chiller ($55-60). When you move up in boil capacity, you also make it harder to chill wort... So you need a wort chiller. The basic copper immersion chillers are sufficient for 5-10 gallons.

Other than that, the other thing I'd say is to get yourself a fermentation fridge... Keep snooping on Craigslist for a free or cheap fridge. Fermentation temp is one of the most important aspects of brewing, and one that most novices (including myself up until a few months ago) don't pay enough attention to. The advantage of this, of course, is that you can always use an old secondary fridge even if for any reason you didn't stick with brewing.

[robert_heat]

Cool... a lot to reply to here.

Regarding the brew pot. The answer unfortunately is I don't know but I will certainly check. The recipe I used called for 3 gallons while making the intial wort and the pot seemed about half full so I am going to guess 5 or 6.

Actually I had a question about that too. I had a set of instructions with the recipe kit. A set that came with the Deluxe equipment kit and a third set that came from the "Instructional" dvd included with the kit.

Both sets of written istructions seemed to imply that I should have a separate boil kettle for dissolving the malt extract? Is this the case? If so I def don't have one of those.

I am totally sold on the wort chiller idea. That sink switch nonsense was stupid.

As for the conical, I am one of those not so manly men that likes a really clean beer, so I guess the question would be whether or not a conical really makes a difference in the sediment in the final brew. If so I might pick one up, otherwise I am fine siphoning.

Temperature control - This is one I really wanted to get your opinions on. Most of us are in CA and so usually it is not a problem but as you know the past couple of weeks have been cold here. My plan for this first batch is as follows. I have an all brick fireplace with a nice area for log storage that fits a big bucket perfectly. Unfortunately I have no way to control the temperature in the area other than my house heater which has been running at 65 degrees for the past few days.

Home depot sells little space heaters that have built in thermostats that are probably fairly unreliable, but perhaps a good temporary fix is to pick on of these up and put it inside the log holder area. This should create at least a fairly constant external temperature as I doubt we will see any 80+ days in the next couple of weeks.

I gave away an old mini-fridge I had a while back and now could kick myself for doing so. I will try to find a cheap used one for brewing in summer months.

As for yeast starters. I have no clue how to do one. I will google it so I don't have to trouble you guys. The recipe I had came with dry yeast and I just pitched that into the wort right after cooling down to under 80 degrees.

I am glad to hear that the bucket thing isn't much of a problem. I do have SOME bubbles in the air lock, so perhaps everything is ok. I plan on moving to secondary fermentation sometime next week as the recipe recommended switching after 1 week.

[lars]

Ok, yeah a few things... the temp range that our yeasties like is pretty narrow, plus fermentation actually gives off heat. So cold is not the main issue, hot on the other hand is. Finding a fridge is probably the best option if you have space for it.

Secondary fermentation - Don't bother. Really there is no additional fermentation that goes on after you rack to a second fermenter that would not go on in the primary fermenter. Just make sure your beer is properly fermented out and then bottle. Not using a secondary fermentation has the additional bonus of avoiding the potential exposure of your beer to additional nasties.

[brahn]

Temperature control - This is one I really wanted to get your opinions on. Most of us are in CA and so usually it is not a problem but as you know the past couple of weeks have been cold here. My plan for this first batch is as follows. I have an all brick fireplace with a nice area for log storage that fits a big bucket perfectly. Unfortunately I have no way to control the temperature in the area other than my house heater which has been running at 65 degrees for the past few days.

With regards to temperature, too cold won't be your problem. Unless the temperature of the beer is dipping into the 40s your ale yeast can probably handle it, though they will slow down a lot. Also remember that the temperature of the beer is probably 6-10 degrees warmer than the air around it during fermentation. What you really want to watch out for is not letting the beer get too hot while it's fermenting. In the worst case, too cold might leave your beer with some unfermented sugars and a really clean taste (maybe some sulfur, but that usually fades), too hot will give you flavors like fruit, spices, hot alcohol, and fusel alcohols. Sometimes you may want some of the fruit, spice and alcohol, but as a general rule I'd suggest trying to keep the fermenting beer below 68 degrees.

[Rezzin]

Welcome to the board. There's a lot of good 'first upgrades' but I would start with temp control like the others mentioned. So scour craigslist for a free or cheap fridge and 'upgrade' by getting a nice digital two stage controller like this. With these two you'll be able to maintain temps within ~1d and your beer will thank you very very much.


full boils
yeast starters
wort chiller

all excellent first upgrades as well

Welcome to the obsession.

[backyard brewer]

I think the biggest impacts on my brewing were:

Really understanding sanitation
Full Boils
Yeast Starters
Temperature controlled fermentation

Each makes a pretty good difference.

[robert_heat]

So I understand the basic concept of a yeast starter, but maybe someone could explain it in a bit more detail? In fact I was thinking it might be helpful if we stickied some articles on the basics so new visitors to the hobby (like me) can easily find information and don't need to bother all of you.

Here are a couple of more questions:

Yeast Starters - How and why?

Temperature Control - You suggested a two-stage which I am assuming would be used for heating and cooling. If I buy a fridge how do I add-on the heater aspect? Just a little space heater or something?

Thanks as always.

[robert_heat]

Does this look like a good turkey fryer?

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... =100655049

[robert_heat]

Here's another that looks not bad, I am wondering if I should just buy an outdoor propane burner and use my existing pot. I do want to move outdoors as I made a mess of the kitchen last time.

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=p ... lpage=none

[BrewMasterBrad]

The Home Depot one will not work for brewing. The Lowes one looks pretty good.

I have a turkey fryer and an 8-gallon pot that I will sell to you if you want to save some money. I don't use them anymore since I built my new system.

Brad

[dhempy]

So I understand the basic concept of a yeast starter, but maybe someone could explain it in a bit more detail? In fact I was thinking it might be helpful if we stickied some articles on the basics so new visitors to the hobby (like me) can easily find information and don't need to bother all of you.

Here are a couple of more questions:

Yeast Starters - How and why?

Temperature Control - You suggested a two-stage which I am assuming would be used for heating and cooling. If I buy a fridge how do I add-on the heater aspect? Just a little space heater or something?

Thanks as always.

Yeast Starter info Here

Dan